Interview by Jan Sander and Patrick Orriëns
September 27, 2006

'Believe me, for me this is a dream come true!'
an interview with Frank Carillo

After being present at the try-out concert of Frank and George in Rijkevorsel we meet again several days later in the Amstel Hotel in Amsterdam were they are having lunch with Henk Schiffmacher and their spouses. The interview location suddenly changes to the Schiffmacher residence on the Amstel River. Before leaving the hotel lounge Frank, the musician passes the grand piano and plays a few chords. The right tone is set for the interview. Leaving the hotel we run into ten's of Madonna fans who are waiting to catch a glimpse of their hero.

Brief biography of Frank Carillo
Frank Carillo was born in Brooklyn, NY and grew up in Queens. Frank was eight years old when he started playing guitar in 1958. 'I saw Duane Eddy on TV. My mom used to watch this TV show called American Bandstand and I never forget it; I am walking by the TV and heard this sound, then looked, as there was this guy who had this big Gretsch guitar who was playing 'Rebel Rouser' and I went "that's what I want to do".'

Today Frank Carillo is a world-class guitar player with a long career. He’s played a.o. on albums by Peter Frampton, Caroline Doctorow, blues legend John Hammond, Jr. and Golden Earring. He recorded an album by French superstar Johnny Hallyday (pour Heleen!). He’s written songs with Carly Simon, Ricky Byrd of Joan Jett & the Blackhearts, his cousin Luke Spagnuola, Annie Golden and Golden Earring. He’s also penned tracks for Dutch singers Anouk and Colleen, Johnny Hallyday, Joan Jett & The Blackhearts and written and produced tracks for supermodel, turned singer, Twiggy. In 1992 Frank and Annie Golden wrote and performed the title track for the movie 'Prelude To A Kiss': 'Waiting For Someone'.

His recording career includes an album with his rock band Doc Holiday and two outings with the band Carillo 'Rings Around The Moon' and 'Street Of Dreams'. He also cut three acoustic albums with vocalist Annie Golden (of the Shirts) in a duo known as Golden Carillo, 'Fire In New Town', 'Toxic Emotion' and 'Back For More'.

Frank toured extensively with bands, such as The Bee Gees, The J. Geils Band, Tom Petty & The Heartbreakers, Bad Company, Cheap Trick and Van Halen. Over the last several years Frank has toured North America and Europe as a member of the John Hammond's band. Last year Frank has formed a new band called Frank Carillo & The Bandoleros and toured throughout North America and Europe to support the release of his great, new CD entitled 'Bad Out There', recorded in the Millbrook Studios, in Millbrook, NY. Does that name ring a bell?

This interview will tell you all about how Frank met George and the other members of Golden Earring.

Frank & George meet
When was the first time you heard about Golden Earring?
'Back in the Seventies we used to hear Golden Earring on the radio and see them on tour. My manager that time was a friend of their manager. He kept saying your next album you'll do at George's studio. We never did the record, but it was always this kind of weird connection that went on over the years, until we finally met in '92.'

Back in 1991 Golden Earring producer John Sonneveld was in New York producing 'Bed Of Nails', a solo album of Randy Jackson of the American hard rock band Zebra. In an earlier interview John talked about a coincidence which happened a year after the production of this album: 'in a studio on Broadway we finished recording a back ground choir and one of the singers was Frank Carillo. The very same Frank Carillo I ran into a year later at George's studio, where I had been asked to mix the cd 'A Fire In New Town' by Golden Carillo.' It was Evert Wilbrink who called George with the request to mix a recording of two American artists in his studio. George on the event: 'One week later Frank and Annie showed up on my driveway completely surprised to have arrived at a house instead of just a studio. That's the story how I got to learn Frank and how we started to work together and became friends.' Two years later George, Frank and John produced several songs of the cd 'Toxic Emotion' of Golden Carillo at George's studio in Belgium. On the album you hear George on backing vocals on 'Gravy Train' and he plays 'additional guitars' on 'Toxic Emotion'.

When you walked into George's studio to mix the album 'A Fire In New Town' did you have any idea to run into George Kooymans of Golden Earring?
'I did, we were supposed to mix the album in a studio in Amsterdam, but they cancelled our studio time. Annie and I had already flown over. At the last minute the record company contacted George. They called me and said you are going to be mixing at George Kooymans' studio 'I said wow, that's fantastic', because I always was a fan of Golden Earring. When we got there in his beautiful home and studio I felt a little uncomfortable for the first hour in somebody else his home, but million, George made us feel like we belonged there. The next morning I was playing guitar when George came in and we started to play Everly Brothers' songs together and have been friends ever since.'

George and Frank stayed in touch and occasionally visit each other in Belgium and New York State. George introduced Frank to Anouk and he wrote two songs 'Pictures On Your Skin' and 'Time Is A Jailer' for Anouk's platinum debut album 'Together Alone' which was released in 1997. For the same album George and Barry wrote 'Fluid Conduction' and 'Mood Indigo'. In 1998 George and Frank wrote two songs for Joep Koelewijn's band Catch 22 'Voices' album: 'I Hear Voices' and the beautiful ballad 'Maybe Roses Never Die'.

How did you get in touch in 2001 with Dutch singer Colleen for whom you wrote 6 songs for her debut album 'Chameleon'?
'Theo de Jong, the drummer of The Shavers, who co-produced the record, is a good friend of mine and found Colleen and said write some songs for her and then I flew over to do some sessions with her.'

Millbrook, NY
In October 2002 and June 2003 Golden Earring went up-state New York to record their most recent studio album 'Millbrook U.S.A.'. Frank's cd's 'A Fire In New Town' and 'Toxic Emotion' are both partly recorded at the Millbrook Studio, the very same studio where Golden Earring recorded 'Millbrook U.S.A.'. On this album you hear Frank on Spanish laud on 'Albino Moon' and 'The Last Frontier Hotel'; on slide guitar on 'Skycraper Hell Of A Town', 'A Sound I Never Heard', 'Kingfisher' and 'Love Is A Looser (When Lust Comes Around)'; on tambura on 'Coming In Going Out' and on dulcimer and harmonium on 'The Thief'. Frank sings backing vocal 'with his deep voice' towards the end of the song 'The Last Frontier Hotel': "Turn on your lights Las Vegas, light up the desert sky; there's no-one waiting for me at the Last Frontier Hotel"!

Frank co-wrote four of the songs of this great Earring album, as is stated on the cover: together with George 'A Sound I Never Heard' and 'Better Off Dead' and with George and Barry 'Coming In Going Out' and 'The Thief'. On 'Kingfisher' Frank is not mentioned as co-writer, however his publishing company is listed on the cover. Frank:' What happened with 'Kingfisher' was that Barry was writing the song and I sat down with him and I might have helped him with a couple of lines. It was his baby lyrically, but they were kind enough to say that I could have some of the publishing rights.'

On the great DVD produced by Dan Lynch Frank can be seen with George, Rinus, Cesar and Barry recording the songs of 'Millbrook U.S.A.'. Dan also shot a great take of Frank announcing Golden Earring at the opening night of Mary's, a pub in Millbrook, on October 26, 2002. The band played an acoustic version of 'Radar Love' and 'Twilight Zone' on a very small stage.

Frank on 'Millbrook U.S.A.': 'the good thing about it was that the band and I became friends over the years, so it made it a very easy experience. It was more like a bunch of friends getting together and having a great time in the studio and having a couple beers and diner. They asked me to play slide or suggest something and I have written a couple of songs with George and Barry. It was an exiting experience, because they are one of my favorite bands from years before. It was great to work with them in the studio.'

In the Barend & Van Dorp TV show during a nationwide broadcast of the national election evening on January 15, 2003 Frank joins Golden Earring on stage playing 'Albino Moon' with his Spanish laud. Frank also joined the band in Bussum on January 20, 2003. Since October 14, 2005 Golden Earring has included Frank's song' 'Watcha Gonna Do (when the levee breaks)' from 'Bad Out there', on the set list of the electric shows.

During the Amsterdam concert of Frank Carillo & the Bandoleros on January 26, 2006 Barry joined Frank on stage to sing 'Watcha Gonna Do (when the levee breaks)' while George is in the audience. Frank was a guest musician of Golden Earring during their show in Ahoy on February 1, 2006 and adds his distinctive guitar sound to 'Watcha Gonna Do (when the levee breaks)' and 'Radar Love'. Frank rehearses the same songs in Noordwijkerhout during a try-out concert on January 28, 2006.

"I think I'll go to India' (from the song 'Wrong #' from Frank's cd 'Bad Out There')
How did you start playing sitar?
'I studied with an Indian teacher in New York, his name is Kinnar, he is a brilliant musician from the Punjab. I accidentally found him when I was driving down the street and saw this woman coming out of a house with what I thought was a sitar, which happened to be a tambura, the drone instrument which goes 'njen' (Frank plays tambura on 'Coming In Going Out';JS). I stopped, rang the bell and Kinnar starting asking some questions that had really nothing to do with music, for example why I cared for certain cultures. He invited me to be his student and that's how I started to learn to play sitar properly. I already had a sitar from the nineteensixties. About Western music I knew a good deal, but in Eastern music I thought I was an infant. It was like starting all over again.

Although I have never worked with George Harrison we became close friends. Peter Frampton introduced me to George back in 1970. He used to invite me to his house and we would play guitar together. We also shared the same spiritual philosophy. George and I were both originally brought up Catholic, but both of us never quite got it. I always thought there was something more than they were saying. George and I found it more in the Indian culture, where it's very open, as far as Hinduism is concerned. I studied on my own even before George and I met. I learned a lot from him about Hinduism. We used to have very long conversations, he was very knowledgeable and also had a great sense of humor. I knew the path I had chosen was the right path and it just so happened that we chose a similar path. Plus we both loved Indian music. We never got on stage together, but we would jam a little bit at home or listen to tapes in the studio. I remember he played some demo's for me that became his 'Cloud Nine' and 'Extra Texture' albums. I remember him saying 'did you ever hear Hoagy Carmichael?'. I said I love him and there is one song I really love and it is some song about somebody kicking Buddha's gong. George started to laugh and puts a reel of tape up and he had recorded that exact song called 'Hong Kong Blues'! I could not believe it!

He was one of the people who changed and influenced my life probably more than anybody else, or one of the top three. He was really a great man. He could be a tough guy when he needed to be, but very straightforward. Always told you the truth. One thing I learned from him is always to be open. He was a very private man. A very generous guy. He had so many levels to him. He was a wonderful, kind of like George Kooymans. George Kooymans is also very generous and has a terrific sense of humor. We like a lot of the same things, we're family guys. I see a lot of that in the two George's.'

Kooymans Carillo
On September 2, 2006 George and Frank, with Rinus on bass, performed a very unique one hour show at the Rosie Lee Roots Blues Festival in Breda and played the following songs: ’Bad Out There', 'Another 45 Miles', 'Wrong #', 'Whisper In A Crowd', 'Maybe Rose Never Die', 'The Naked Truth', 'Chapel Street',' As Long As The Wind Blows', 'Watcha Gonna Do (when the levee breaks)', 'Twilight Zone', Red Queen', 'A Sound I Never Heard' and an up-tempo version of 'Low Rider'. The non-Earring songs are from Frank's 2005 album "Bad Out There', with the exception of 'Maybe Roses Never Die', which is, as written above, a Kooymans & Carillo song for Joep Koelewijn. According to Rinus 'Maybe Roses Never Die' 'is a true Earring song'. Of course 'Low Rider' is from George's first solo album 'JoJo' of 1971. The song is one of George's favorites, as his George Kooymans Band started the concert at Zuiderpark-Pop on June 30, 1985 also with 'Low Rider'.

(This show reminds me of an acoustic concert of Barry and George more than 10 years ago at a music fair on September 17,1993 in Ahoy. They played 'Another 45 Miles’,’ Why Do I', 'As Long As The Wind Blows’,’ Twilight Zone' and 'Going To The Run'.)

Two days earlier George, Frank and Rinus did a great 'secret' try-out concert in Rijkevorsel, Belgium, George's home town. For the songs see the set list below. During his introduction of 'As Long As The Wind Blows' and while wiping his head off with a towel, George remarked: 'ít's not only the sweat, I always have to weep with this song'.This acoustic show was truly a great event and it shows the great talent of George, Frank and Rinus and their fantastic songs. After finishing 'Another 45 miles' the front rows of the audience could hear Frank say to George: 'Believe me, for me this is a dream come true!' It was very obvious the band enjoyed the show.

Before the Rijkevorsel concert George, Frank and Rinus did rehearse for 1 hour and 45 minutes. For the songs see the setlist below. During the rehearsal Frank joked about not knowing the lyrics to 'Twilight Zone'; I'm destroying a classic, I forgot the lyrics. For the concert I will attach the lyric sheet to my guitar'. So he did, as the picture shows!

Who came up with the idea of the concert with George and Rinus? How did you select the songs? What is the major difference between a show like this with just the 3 of you and playing with a band like Golden Earring?
'George and I have been writing on and off for years and always wanted to do a record, but with our schedules it's been very hard. When I was on tour in Germany and Holland in January the promoter for the Roots festival came to my gig in Leiden and asked to do a concert with George. George and I said, yeah, let's do it. George suggested Rinus to play bass; I thought it's great to have a bass player and especially Rinus, he is fantastic. George called and said: we do five of mine and five of yours and a couple of the songs we did together; how do you want to do it; I answered: I don't care you just pick them, so he did. After the Rijkevorsel and Breda concerts we want to do more of these. It’s really different, with just two acoustic guitars, a bass, two voices and no drums. It's very raw, very stripped down.'

How would you describe George's way of guitar playing?
'George's guitar playing at points is almost classical and blues at the same time with the soul and heart of rock & roll. George not only writes beautiful melodies, but when he plays solo's, there is always some sort of a great melody going through it, even if he is playing something really flashy, really cool. His rhythm playing is always big and open and he has these great cord changes; he'll go for something that's obvious and then all of a sudden he just changes lanes and what’s really interesting about writing with George is his way of switching gears! I might say I've got something and play him a verse, but I can't go anymore and I say take it and he will switch gears and comes up with a good song.'

A few words on Barry, Rinus and Cesar:
'Rinus is a great bass player. Great guy to talk to and as a person he is 'very deep'. Barry is a ton of fun; he's great to be around, he's always coming up with ideas; Cesar is a fantastic drummer and tells the best jokes on this side of the Atlantic, great to be around and he has the best eyebrows! They are all great to work with.'

Do you have a favorite guitar?
'My favorite guitar right now is the red Gretsch Billy-Bo (Bo Diddley; JS). George and I were talking for some time about the Billy-Bo and when I played in Holland with The Bandoleros and stayed to do the Ahoy show we were backstage in the dressing room and again talking about the Billy-Bo. George said what do you think? I said you got to have it, so I made a call to a friend in the United States and said to him we need two Billy-Bo's; send one to George and keep one for me when I get home. They look like a Cadillac. I use a bunch of different Gretsch's. Brian Setzer (of The Stray Cats; JS) gave me a Gretsch which is the prototype for the Gretsch Brian Setzer 6120, the orange one, and then I have a couple of old Gretsch's that I use.'

Would you describe yourself as a songwriter or guitar player?
'I started out as a guitarist, never meant to be a singer. I wanted to be the guitar player and write songs. In my passport it would state musician.'

George, how would you describe Frank's way of guitar playing?
'Frank is a real master, he got this great tone and feel. Frank definitely has his own style, he is one of a kind. He is more rhythm and blues than I am and also folk. Every time I play with him I try to learn. This feeling started the very first time we played Everly Brothers' song in my house. The vocals also macth, as I have this light, high pitched vocal, although sometimes I can go low and Frank has this bluesy and raw voice, although he can also come up quite high. Like Barry and I we also match very well.'

Frank's funny quote on the cd cover of 'Bad Out There' states: 'Kooy, we'll finish these songs, yet. We may even still have teeth!' George, the obvious question: will the two of you make an album together?
'For years we wanted to make an album together; we have been talking about it for the past 10 or 12 years now. We wrote a couple of songs which I still have on tape, but which are not finished yet. We have decided to get together in Millbrook after Christmas and record the songs we have and write some new material. It’s a matter of booking the studio, get together and do it!'

Did Golden Earring ever consider recording 'Maybe Roses Never Die'?
'I never really thought about it, although it has an Earring type of a feel. It’s a great song and as we have played it in Rijkevorsel and Breda we might do it in the acoustic shows if Barry wants it too!'

On September 5 before flying back to New York Frank was a guest in the Crossroads radio program in Bergen op Zoom. It was broadcasted before a live audience. Frank did several songs on his own. George joined him on stage during a new Carillo song called 'Roll The Bones'. Frank and George worked on several new songs during his recent stay with George.

Many thanks to Frank and George for the interview.
Thanks to Patrick Orriëns for doing the interview together, his research and taking most of the pictures.
Thanks to Casper Roos for the tour dates.
Thanks to Henk and Louise Schiffmacher for their hospitality.

Jan Sander
The Hague, September 2006

Sources: www.frankcarillo.com

Setlist of try-out concert August 31, 2006 in Rijkevorsel
'Bad Out There'
'Another 45 Miles'
'Wrong #'
'Whisper In A Crowd'
'Maybe Rose Never Die'
'The Naked Truth'
'Chapel Street'
'As Long As The Wind Blows'
'Watcha Gonna Do (when the levee breaks)'
'Twilight Zone'
'Red Queen'; and as encore an up-tempo version of
'Low Rider'.

Setlist rehearsel for try-out concert August 31, 2006 in Rijkevorsel
'Bad Out There'
'Maybe Rose Never Die’
’The Naked Truth'
'Chapel Street'
'Red Queen'
'Another 45 Miles'
''Whisper In A Crowd'
'Watcha Gonna Do (when the levee breaks)'
'Wrong #''
'Twilight Zone'
'As Long As The Wind Blows' and again
'Maybe Roses Never Die' and 'Watcha Gonna Do (when the levee breaks)'